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| | | Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s |  |
| | | Auteur | Message |
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Blackbolt
Amazing member
Age : 32
Localisation : Cherche Serafina. Vous l'avez-vu?
Date d'inscription : 14/09/2007
| | Sujet: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 18:05 | |
| Classement selon Marvel qui présente les stars des années 80 et 90
Surprise Surprise!
'80s: - Spoiler:
10. THE BLACK CAT
First Appearance: AMAZING SPIDER-MAN #194 (1979)
Spotlight Comic: AMAZING SPIDER-MAN #195—The awesome origin of the Black Cat!
9. TASKMASTER
First Appearance: AVENGERS #195 (1980)
Spotlight Comic: AVENGERS #196—Taskmaster takes on Earth's Mightiest Heroes, the Avengers!
8. THE HELLFIRE CLUB
First Appearance: UNCANNY X-MEN #129 (1980)
Why They Make The List: "The Hellfire Club's introduction not only provided the X-Men with some of their most memorable foes—and one future ally in the White Queen—but also introduced something very new to the X-mythos: class-based discrimination. Magneto and The X-Men fought over ideology, but the Hellfire Club didn't care about any of those philosophical bouts, they just wanted to prosper. They considered themselves a better kind of mutant and felt they should have the real power. They never had any inhibitions about displaying their genetic superiority and possessed a confidence that was both inspiring and terrifying. Whereas the X-Men and Magneto fought for mutantkind, each with flaws in their methods, the Hellfire Club fought for themselves." –
Spotlight Comic: UNCANNY X-MEN #134—The X-Men battle the Hellfire Club's Inner Circle, with the fate of Phoenix on the line!
7. ELEKTRA
First Appearance: DAREDEVIL v1 #168 (1981)
Why She Makes The List: "Half of one of Marvel's most epic romances, Elektra redefined the role of female characters when she sprang forth from the imagination of Frank Miller. Matt Murdock's gentle college lover returned to the life of Daredevil as a vicious assassin, Elektra combined beauty and danger in a package that exceeded just about any femme fatale to come before. Her doomed love for Matt and the hint of tragedy behind her brutal efficiency contributed to making her an enigmatic and incredibly popular character—so popular that she would conquer death and become a Marvel icon years after her memorable debut." –
Spotlight Comic: DAREDEVIL: THE MAN WITHOUT FEAR #2—Journey back to the formative years of Matt Murdock and Elektra's love and witness the tragedy that changed her life forever!
6. DAZZLER
First Appearance: UNCANNY X-MEN #130 (1980)
Why She Makes The List: "Only one paragraph to describe the awesomeness, the fabulousness, the diva that is Dazzler? Okay. In UNCANNY X-MEN #130, she debuts and turns down the X-Men. Stones right there. But it worked in her favor as she concentrated on her career, generating huge album sales, and she got her own movie. But then she was revealed to the public as a mutant. It was this forced outing that updated the X-Men metaphor for this generation from the Civil Rights movement of the early '60s to the Social Rights issues people still face today. Not willing to go quietly, this songbird became a beacon in the night, illuminating the world around her, fighting the hatred thrown at people just for being different. She became a fighter, an X-Man and an inspiration to many." –
Spotlight Comic: UNCANNY X-MEN #130—The dynamic debut of the Dazzler!
5. HOBGOBLIN
First Appearance: AMAZING SPIDER-MAN #238 (1983)
Why He Makes The List: "After Stan Lee, Steve Ditko and friends populated Spider-Man's rogues gallery with dozens of memorable faces in the years following the character's debut, the Web Slinger suffered a bit of a drought in the bad guy department for some time, but the Hobgoblin represented a change to all that when he glided onto the scene in 1983. Combining elements of the classic Green Goblin with a new air of mystery and aggressive attitude, Hobby became the pivot for many a classic Spidey story during his unrelenting quest to conquer the New York underworld. Hobgoblin became the first of a new breed of more dangerous villains who made it clear to Peter Parker that he was not a kid anymore." –
Spotlight Comic: AMAZING SPIDER-GIRL #6—Spider-Man's daughter duels with the horrible Hobgoblin!
4. CLOAK & DAGGER
First Appearance: SPECTACULAR SPIDER-MAN v1 #64 (1982)
Why They Make The List: "Okay, they are just cool, darn it. These two faced overwhelming odds and they did it together, yin and yang, light and dark. They are one of the best duos in the Marvel Universe. They even fought in 'Maximum Carnage!' Sure it's a staple of today that 'everyone has their own Cloak & Dagger pitch in,' and it seems that they may be outdated, but when done right—see: RUNAWAYS—Cloak & Dagger prove they are awesome, even today." –
Spotlight Comic: RUNAWAYS v2 #9—Cloak recruits the Runaways to save the life of Dagger!
3. SHE-HULK
First Appearance: SAVAGE SHE-HULK #1 (1980)
Why She Makes The List: "When she first appeared as the 'Savage' She-Hulk, the Hulk's cousin Jennifer Walters was a kinda cool, but ultimately pale, imitation of her rampaging relative. However, when John Byrne and other creative luminaries got hold of Shulkie later in the '80s and decided to replace her rage with an insatiable whimsy for life and adventure. One of Marvel's most outgoing and enjoyable characters of the era, She-Hulk instantly became a fan favorite and, in between stints with the Avengers, replaced the Thing for a memorable spell during Byrne's run writing and drawing the Fantastic Four. To this day, She-Hulk's boisterous sense of humor and unapologetic flirtatiousness and zest has kept her at the forefront of Marvel's pantheon." –
Spotlight Comic: FANTASTIC FOUR #268—She-Hulk and the rest of the FF stare down the legacy of Dr. Doom!
2. THE NEW MUTANTS
First Appearance: MARVEL GRAPHIC NOVEL #4 (1982)
Why They Make The List: "They were 'my' X-Men. As I was getting into comics, the 'Dark Phoenix Saga' had happened, the post-Phoenix team was well formed and there were 20 years of continuity tied up in them. I read them, but I always felt like I was trying to catch up. Then they 'died' and Professor X had to form a new team—the New Mutants. They were in school, like me. They didn't know if they would ever live up to those that came before them, and they were the outcasts. But they formed a tight bond, a family almost that hadn't been seen since the days of Xavier's first five students. They went on to be their own X-Men team in X-Force, and many have graduated, but nothing beats the first 50 issues when they were all together." –
Spotlight Comic: NEW MUTANTS v1 #21—The New Mutants meet Warlock—in the midst of their slumber party!
1. KITTY PRYDE
First Appearance: UNCANNY X-MEN #129 (1980)
Why She Makes The List: "Not the first time she has conquered Take 10, Kitty Pryde continues to prove that she is one of the most important characters in the Marvel U. In the '60s and '70s, Peter Parker was the everyman, the person you could relate to. The X-Men, on the other hand, were 'All-New, All-Different,' and really creepy, to be honest. Enter: Kitty Pryde. She gave us a relatable character, a fresh pair of eyes and a character to grow up with. Whether telling a fairy tale, fighting aliens alone on a Christmas Eve, having her heart broken by her first love or rising up to become someone truly astonishing, Kitty is the best character to come out of the 1980s not due to power or costume or gimmick, but because she is the most well-rounded. And she is deeply missed." –
Spotlight Comic: UNCANNY X-MEN #139—Kitty Pryde's first day with the X-Men features thrills, twists and plenty of danger!
'90s:- Spoiler:
10. DARKHAWK
First Appearance: DARKHAWK #1 (1991)
Spotlight Comic: THE LONERS #1—Darkhawk and other heroes of the past attempt to hang up the tights but find the lure of adventure too strong!
9. CROSSBONES
First Appearance: CAPTAIN AMERICA v1 #359 (1989)
Spotlight Comic: CAPTAIN AMERICA v5 #18—Crossbones and Sin mess with Captain America in jolly old England!
8. PETE WISDOM
First Appearance: EXCALIBUR v1 #86
Why He Makes The List: "Only one man in the Marvel Universe exudes that British charm like no other, and that man is Peter Wisdom. Not a fan of the tights, this former British Intelligence agent keeps it classy 24/7 in a suit and tie. Think James Bond but with the ability to throw knifes made of pure heat at his enemies. If this bloke ain't crackin' I don't know who is!"
Currently Appearing In: CAPTAIN BRITAIN AND MI: 13
Spotlight Comic: NEW EXCALIBUR #1—Pete Wisdom helps to gather Captain Britain and the rest of the new Excalibur team!
7. GHOST RIDER (DANNY KETCH)
First Appearance: GHOST RIDER v3 #1 (1990)
Why He Makes The List: "Anything but a Johnny Blaze knock-off, Danny Ketch rocketed Ghost Rider into the '90s with a new bike and a much darker attitude. Transforming into GR for the first time after his sister was shot, Ketch embarked on a grim career full of personal tragedy, public contempt and the crushing pressure of acting as the Spirit of Vengeance. Between his haunted life and his fiery skull—not to mention his spike-studded jacket—Danny Ketch oozed '90s cool and was the perfect Ghost Rider for a new era."
Currently Appearing In: GHOST RIDER
Spotlight Comic: FANTASTIC FOUR #348—Danny Ketch teams with Spider-Man, Wolverine and the Hulk as the new Fantastic Four!
6. MONET
First Appearance: UNCANNY X-MEN #316 (1994)
Why She Makes The List: "Many of you might be surprised to see her on here, but from her debut, M established herself as something different: a jerk. Now don't get me wrong, she certainly had redeeming qualities, but false humility and obeying social norms certainly weren't either of them. As Monet was quick to show everyone, she was simply better than most mutants. She had the money, the power, the super-powers and the beauty to have anything she wanted in life. Monet was a fresh breath of air as she showed the upsides—along with the downsides—of being genetically superior. We knew we had someone special on her hands—and she knew it too." –
Currently Appearing In: X-FACTOR
Spotlight Comic: X-FACTOR v2 #13—Monet and the rest of X-Factor Investigations face the psychiatric examinations of Doc Samson!
5. CHAMBER
First Appearance: GENERATION X #1 (1994)
Why He Makes The List: "For every Wolverine and Colossus—bad ass, attractive, iconic mutants—there'll always be a few guys like Chamber. Jonothon Starsmore was just your average English dude who wanted to go clubbing with his girl when—Bam—his mutant power kicked in and blew half his damn face off. Literally. While Jono lost part of his face and upper body to his psionic abilities, he vaulted up fans' cool-scale thanks to his killer accent, crazy appearance and membership in Generation X. While he may be depowered—though now with a face!—he's still tearin' it up with the New Warriors, under the codename Decibel."
Currently Appearing In: NEW WARRIORS (as Decibel)
Spotlight Comic: GENERATION M #1—Chamber faces the devastating fallout of M-Day!
4. CAPTAIN MARVEL (GENIS-VELL)
First Appearance: SILVER SURFER ANNUAL #6 (1993)
Why He Makes The List: "The character originally named Legacy could have been doomed to mediocrity and lame '90s-ocity with his cheese-tastic ponytail, but Genis-Vell, having taken up the mantle of Captain Marvel after his father, got scooped up into AVENGERS FOREVER and then his own ongoing series, becoming a layered, nuanced and unpredictable hero thanks to writers Kurt Busiek, Roger Stern and Peter David. Between bonding with Rick Jones, going completely insane and finally spending his final moments battling with and alongside the Thunderbolts, we happily accepted Genis-Vell as Captain Marvel."
Spotlight Comic: NEW THUNDERBOLTS #12—Genis may be the Thunderbolts' last hope against the power of the Purple Man!
3. GAMBIT
First Appearance: UNCANNY X-MEN #266 (1990)
Why He Makes The List: "There are few characters in X-Men history more polarizing than the 'Ragin' Cajun,' so if you don't like rogues with a heart of gold and their grand, romantic, tragic pasts…well, then Gambit isn't for you! Even before he was revealed as a pawn of Mr. Sinister, his involvement with the Thieves' Guild and potential identity as the X-traitor made him instantly compelling, adding a new dimension to the X-Men. Not since Wolverine had a character joined the team and so rallied against their norms, pining after Rogue and doing things his own way, with a cavalier attitude that even the aforementioned Canucklehead didn't expect! Once it was revealed that he helped the Marauders slaughter the Morlocks, Gambit went from simply being cool to being something even more—a man seeking redemption for a crime that many would define as irredeemable."
Currently Appearing In: X-MEN: LEGACY
Spotlight Comic: GAMBIT v2 #10—It's Gambit's most daring job ever as he must pull a heist right under the X-Men's noses!
2. DEADPOOL
First Appearance: NEW MUTANTS v1 #98 (1990)
Why He Makes The List: "For a guy who seemed initially conceived to be more or less 'Wolverine with wisecracks,' Deadpool has remained not only one of the most enduring characters to emerge from the '90s, but one of the most popular creations of the past 20-plus years. 'Pool has a quirky charm that has garnered him a nearly unrivaled cult appeal, carried him into toys and video games and will next year lead him to the big screen courtesy of Ryan Reynolds' portrayal of the 'Merc With a Mouth' in 'X-Men Origins: Wolverine.' Unquestionably Wade Wilson's unique and manic sense of humor accounts for a great deal of his continued prosperity, but writers from Joe Kelly to Fabian Nicieza have mined classic stories from Deadpool's ongoing quest to become perhaps not quite a hero, but something more than what he has been in a world that always seems against him. And there's no question that the Rob Liefeld-designed red and black costume, which has been rendered by luminaries such as Ed McGuinness and Joe Madureira among others, is a kick-ass classic." –
Currently Appearing In: DEADPOOL (beginning this September)
Spotlight Comic: CABLE & DEADPOOL #12—It's two times the Deadpool when the Merc With a Mouth throws down against Agent X!
1. CABLE
First Appearance (As Cable): NEW MUTANTS v1 #87 (1990)
Why He Makes The List: "There is no character who epitomizes the '90s as much as Cable. The time-traveling mutant did embrace some of the clichés, including a) a 'mysterious' past, b) really oversized weapons and c) a tough guy attitude, but something about Cable made those same clichés seem, dare I say, cool? Even without the complicated back story, the idea of a paramilitary mutant force was inspired and the original X-Force remains one of the most interesting wrinkles in X-Men lore because of how diametrically opposed the mission, method and team were to the other X-groups. As for the true origin of Cable, there was an elegance in how it all worked out—being the son of Cyclops and turning up to be somewhat of a thorn in his father's side was engaging, with the inherent tragedy of the arc—a father giving up his son for the greater good—as truly compelling stuff. Plus, c'mon—that big gun is awesome!" –
Currently Appearing In: CABLE
Spotlight Comic: NEW MUTANTS v1 #87—Cable bursts on the scene for the very first time!
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| | | | Marvel
Dark member
Age : 33
Localisation : Perdu dans un bordel en Inde.
Date d'inscription : 24/05/2006
| | Sujet: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 19:01 | |
| Nan mais là c'est plus possible.
Trois fois que Kitty est sur une liste faite par Marvel ou des gens cossus (Stan Lee and co), et sur les trois deux sont des classements où elle a la première position à chaque fois. A chaque fois annoncés par la même personne, d'ailleurs ^^
Donc soit Blackbolt nous manipule tous, soit Marvel nous prépare quelque chose avec elle.
(j'aimerais pouvoir dire qu'effectivement je prépare quelque chose avec Kitty, mais nan ^^' Mouhahaha !)
Ps: j'aime pas trop cable, j'aurais bien aimé que Gambit et Deadpool soient premier et deuxième, mais bon ils sont dans le top trois au moins | |
| | | | Hyperion
Immortal member
Age : 41
Localisation : Lille (Nord)
Date d'inscription : 08/05/2006
| | Sujet: Re: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 19:09 | |
| Space en effet vu tu sais quoi... Bizarre.  | |
| | | | Marvel
Dark member
Age : 33
Localisation : Perdu dans un bordel en Inde.
Date d'inscription : 24/05/2006
| | Sujet: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 20:10 | |
| J'y ai pensé aussi.
Je m'attendais bien à ce que le couple Peter/Kitty soit dans le top 5 de l'autre classement. Premiers, ça m'a étonné, mais après tout pourquoi pas ? C'était pas du tout inenvisageable.
Ici, ç'aurait carrément été injuste qu'elle ne soit pas dans le classement. Et je trouve tout à fait concevable qu'elle y soit première. Rien à dire.
Par contre, pour le truc des "meilleurs super-héros de tous les temps" (phrase de légende, comme le disait Blackbolt) c'est assez délirant qu'elle ait été sélectionnée, je trouve  Même moi j'aurais pas osé.
Les deux premiers passent largement, le troisième est plus qu'étrange. les trois ensembles... Honnêtement, j'en viens sincèrement à penser qu'il y a quelque chose derrière.
En plus on a aussi la série "Wolverine first class", dont j'avais dit en rigolant à moitié- Spoiler:
qu'elle pourrait avoir pour but de compenser la mort de Kitty.
Là on peut s'attendre à quelque chose... Peut-être que Claremont ou Whedon -un gars de cette envergure en tous cas- a un énorme projet pour elle, et que du coup Marvel veut s'en servir pour faire de Shadowcat la nouvelle égérie des comics 
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| | | | Hyperion
Immortal member
Age : 41
Localisation : Lille (Nord)
Date d'inscription : 08/05/2006
| | Sujet: Re: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 20:45 | |
| Ben écoute peut-être, mais en attendant c'est pas dans les dernières news, tu sais bien qui est à l'honneur. Et elle est pas brune.  Enfin si mais y a longtemps, lol. Mais ils se basent sur quoi pour leurs classements, parce que bon à côté de ça la Cape et l'Epée et Hobgobelin... Kitty, star des X-Men de l'époque je veux bien, mais de tout Marvel. | |
| | | | Blackbolt
Amazing member
Age : 32
Localisation : Cherche Serafina. Vous l'avez-vu?
Date d'inscription : 14/09/2007
| | Sujet: Re: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 21:06 | |
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| | | | Marvel
Dark member
Age : 33
Localisation : Perdu dans un bordel en Inde.
Date d'inscription : 24/05/2006
| | Sujet: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 21:20 | |
|
Dernière édition par Marvel le Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 21:23, édité 1 fois | |
| | | | Blackbolt
Amazing member
Age : 32
Localisation : Cherche Serafina. Vous l'avez-vu?
Date d'inscription : 14/09/2007
| | | | | Hyperion
Immortal member
Age : 41
Localisation : Lille (Nord)
Date d'inscription : 08/05/2006
| | Sujet: Re: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 21:23 | |
| Oui mais Marvel quand tu parles de Kitty, excuse moi de te dire que tu n'es jamais très objectif. Peut-être qu'avec le film et les DA elle a gagné en popularité, mais avant ça Kitty était quand même loin d'être la plus connue des X-Men. | |
| | | | Blackbolt
Amazing member
Age : 32
Localisation : Cherche Serafina. Vous l'avez-vu?
Date d'inscription : 14/09/2007
| | | | | Marvel
Dark member
Age : 33
Localisation : Perdu dans un bordel en Inde.
Date d'inscription : 24/05/2006
| | Sujet: Re: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 21:25 | |
| - Hyperion a écrit:
- Peut-être qu'avec le film et les DA elle a gagné en popularité, mais avant ça Kitty était quand même loin d'être la plus connue des X-Men.
Bah à l'époque non, mais aujourd'hui elle est carrément plus connue que Miss Hulk and co je crois, et c'est sur ça que se base Marvel en partie pour faire son classement: sur le succès qu'ont eu les persos. | |
| | | | Hyperion
Immortal member
Age : 41
Localisation : Lille (Nord)
Date d'inscription : 08/05/2006
| | Sujet: Re: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 21:30 | |
| Moi je dirais ça dépend de quel public. Parce que la série "Miss Hulk" de Slott et David a quand même son public et Jennifer bénéficie d'une série solo, ce qui n'est pas le cas de Kitty ; enfin avant First Class qui pour moi ne compte pas vraiment. Sinon le classement là avec Kitty en 3ème position, c'est du n'importe nawak : Dents-de-Sabre (AoA) avant Psylocke et Emma. Qu'est-ce qu'il vient foutre là ? lol Tout est mélangé : Madrox, Blink (AoA), etc... | |
| | | | Marvel
Dark member
Age : 33
Localisation : Perdu dans un bordel en Inde.
Date d'inscription : 24/05/2006
| | | | | Blackbolt
Amazing member
Age : 32
Localisation : Cherche Serafina. Vous l'avez-vu?
Date d'inscription : 14/09/2007
| | | | | Hyperion
Immortal member
Age : 41
Localisation : Lille (Nord)
Date d'inscription : 08/05/2006
| | Sujet: Re: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Jeu 17 Juil 2008 - 21:53 | |
| Je ne sais pas Marvel. Je ne regarde pas les dessins animés, surtout Evolution, donc à vrai dire je suis mauvais juge. Peut-être que ce DA a une grande influence sur les gens qui ne sont pas vraiment dans les comics.
Mais j'aurai dit auparavant que Miss Hulk avait plus de popularité que Kitty, mais surtout dans les gens de Comics.
Question X-Men par exemple, ça fait quelques années et ça depuis le premier DA X-Men, que Malicia a la palme de popularité. Donc peut-être qu'Evolution a changé les choses, possible, oui...
Je suis quand même très surpris, mais soit. | |
| | | | JessieRedball
Sensationnal member
Age : 45
Localisation : Libourne
Date d'inscription : 09/05/2007
| | Sujet: Re: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Ven 18 Juil 2008 - 0:04 | |
| Je repond à Marvel parce que personne le fait... et que j'adore le personnage...
En français, le Hobgoblin, c'est le Super-Bouffon... Un mec qui a repris l'arsenal du Bouffon Vert.
Le premier etait une brute recrutée pour tester l'arsenal mais Spidey l'a vaincu facile, et le deuxieme (le vrai) est resté longtemps mysterieux, laissant entendre qu'il pourrait être JJJ, Flash Thompson ou un photographe rival de Peter Parker à l'époque, Lance Bannon. Il s'avera plus tard que c'etait Ned Leeds, le mari de Betty Brant, mais c'etait en fait un coup monté après un lavage de cerveau sur le bellâtre. Macendale (à l'époque Jack O'Lantern) le fait tuer pour prendre sa place mais il passe un contrat avec un demon (Nastir'th, je crois mais peut etre Mephisto) et devient fou. Il rejoint Les sinistres 6, puis son entité démoniaque se sépare de lui, et devient le Démogoblin. Beaucoup plus tard on découvre que le premier Hobgoblin était un parfumeur, Roderick Kingsley, ruiné par le crime et qui se refait une santé par le crime. Il est arrêté et jugé grace à Betty qui venge ainsi son mari.
Il est peu connu car pas souvent revenu, mais il reste emblématique des méchants de Spidey dans les années 80 (époque où le retour de Norman Osborn était inimaginable) et symbolique de la "saga des bouffons".
En lisant Secret War, j'ai vu qu'il y'en avait un nouveau, et j'adore sa fiche par Nick Fury: "On ignore qui il est, mais vu ce que represente les bouffons pour Spidey, ce gars là à de fortes chances de l'avoir énervé. Il a pas choisi le bon costume."
Sinon Hobgoblin, c'est aussi (je crois) un membre de l'imperial Guard, mais si c'est lui je suis encore plus surpris...
A part ca, le classement ne me déplait pas, mais, comme je ne sais plus qui l'a dit, j'aurais préféré voir Gambit (voire Deadpool) devant Cable. | |
| | | | Marvel
Dark member
Age : 33
Localisation : Perdu dans un bordel en Inde.
Date d'inscription : 24/05/2006
| | | | | Fred le Mallrat
Amazing member
Age : 50
Localisation : bordeaux
Date d'inscription : 24/08/2006
| | Sujet: Re: Top 10: We Love the '80s and the '90s Ven 18 Juil 2008 - 12:45 | |
| on peut aussi se dire que dans les 80's, Kitty a eu plus de succes...
C etait l'Xwoman la plus proche du lecteur.. (cree pour ca)
Savage Shehulk... fut un echec creatif et populaire...
Elle fut presente aux seins des avengers et FF, c est sur...
Mais même en etant fans des avengers ... Kitty etait le perso des 80's... surement avec Elektra..
car les 80's ce fut apres surtout la consecration de peros des 70's (Punisher et Wolverine)
Je suis surpris de voir crossbones dans les 90's.... mais surpris agreablement car je l adore | |
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